I *broadly* agree with you, with two moderate caveats
1. The power grid needs, in many cases, to be upgraded and stabilized to support the needs of both the data centers and their surrounding communities, which is not trivial
2. Water supplies likewise need substantial work in many locations
The data center owners have, thus far, not been “wildly successful” in either case, and are proving to be less-than-ideal neighbors
That’s the physical infrastructure side of the coin
On the point of “existential angst”, for those whose livelihoods are or will be affected by AI, we need to pay close attention to the lessons learned from previous technology revolutions
Clear, timely, useful, accurate information has to be made available, and there needs to be some kind of plan to help people shift and adapt
The last revolution - PCs and the internet - took about 15 years to have its full impact felt across the board. This one will be much faster
“Everything will be just fine, trust me bro” isn’t the most trustworthy or reassuring message, even if it’s true
1. If we didn't build another data center and only look to the EV market the grid is woefully underbuilt. The states pushing hardest for EV adoption haven't bothered to invest in transmission and generation. The good news is that the hyperscalers want to build their own generation behind the meter. The biggest obstacle to this are the regulated utilities who don't want to be cut out of the equation.
2. Water is an issue everywhere - but data centers aren't the cause - growth is. My first startup in the late 90s built and ran data centers (LayerOne) and we never used water for cooling. The fact is that using water to cool a data center only makes sense if the water is abundant and cheaper than the corresponding electricity that air cooling would require. That means that water isn't an issue in 99% of cases. On top of that new technology has made water cooled solutions far more efficient than they were in the 90s.
3. We had data centers in Dallas, St. Louis, Chicago, New York City, Miami and Los Angeles. I don't think most people knew what was inside our buildings. No one ever complained.
4. As for surrendering the Ai race to China, I believe that could be an existential threat to our national security for a million reasons. At the end of the day, China is moving forward at full speed and I don't want them to control the alignment of our models - I'm worried enough about OpenAi and Antropic's woke Ai alignment.
5. As for 'trust me bro' - I recommend against that. We need federal preemption on Ai regulation and we need best practices for data center permitting - teach the states how to get the best deal for their citizens.
Thanks for the response. I generally agree, especially re: the surrendering to China. I am not against AI data centers, I just think we need to take appropriate steps to assure we effectively address the concerns given that the DCs are larger and do consume more resources than "traditional" data centers . I sold hosting services before retiring in 2010 and was familiar with data center construction and use at that time - not so much now. To me, the biggest issue with power is the push for weather dependent, intermittent, variable, unreliable, grid damaging and expensive wind and solar to replace reliable fossil fuel power plants - including coal. That is what is putting the greatest strain on the grid. When you consider the entire life cycle for wind and solar, it becomes clear that they are far more environmentally destructive than simply using hydrocarbons to begin with given that they are effectively 100% dependent on hydrocarbons from cradle to grave starting with the massive amount of mining and processing required to extract the minerals needed for their manufacture, then transport, manufacture, site prep, life cycle maintenance and ultimate decommissioning and disposal with the added benefit of a relatively short life span so they need to be "renewed" more frequently. That, and the land use issue.
I also think that concerns about specific locations (such as placing them too close to existing populations or using eminent domain because they “prefer” the site) need to be addressed. As someone put it, there’s no shortage of open spaces in this country. I understand that infrastructure is necessary but our infrastructure already needs a ton of work, so combine the two.
There's one factor in AI that I haven't yet seen addressed: the Panopticon Effect.
Right now, we literally have no anonymity from either private or government snooping. If the government wants to avoid the whole "probable cause" effect, they can just buy all kinds of data that they physically couldn't have gotten access to because your commercial transactions, where you went, who you met, etc. were all considered as part of your "private papers". That started eroding with the advent of the internet. Then it accelerated through cell phones and "smart devices", but there were still limitations because a human being had to think to ask, and then analyze the data with their own human brains.
Once data mining became a thing, it was obvious where this was headed. Now, with Agentic AI, we have a 24/7/365 army of snoops to crawl through the data looking for any hint of non-conformity. And there's effectively NO requirement even for suspicion. Just ask the clanker to spit out anyone's name at all, regardless of bias in the AI and it's training data. Heck, this blog comment is probably a red flag. And once a flag goes up, our three felonies a day legal system will provide Beria with a long list of crimes.
It would be a good thing if President Trump would put out a regulation requiring probable cause and a warrant before commercial data can be accessed for legal purposes, because it's part of the 4th Amendment "private papers".
Better would be for Congress to say that in a formal law, and / or SCOTUS to confirm.
Best would be to add an Amendment saying the 4th Amendment "private papers" includes electronic records from any source.
We haven’t had privacy in a long time. It is getting worse. China is using the vast data about their citizens to predict, based on what you movies you watch, books you read, what you buy, what channel your TV is on at what time - if you’re going to be a problem. Pre-crime is real in China.
However, the average citizen has had a 4 year tutorial in what that means. But of course saying you don't trust the government will still get you labeled paranoid. Answer: Use the paranoia that's acceptable: ecological ctastrophe.
Correct with one addition - land use and siting. While worries about "big brother" or job losses are concerning to some, I think they are a bit exaggerated. But the power issues, water usage and siting are the real issues in communities that are fighting them. AI data centers are larger, require a lot mor power and while closed loop water cooling systems can mitigate water usage issues, they don't eliminate them. Also, their cooling systems make a lot of noise so when sited near a residential area, they do have an impact. That, and like is shown in the linked article, when power companies take over homesites via imminent domain, they don't endear themselves to the locals. https://blackmon.substack.com/p/a-message-for-datacenter-developers?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=712558&post_id=197488474&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=kv2ig&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email
I just looked at this deal. Same thing is happening here in Texas. So basically, Georgia Power wants to sell more electricity. They convince a hyperscaler to build their 800 acre facility near their power plant instead of them building their own power generation behind the meter. To get the power to the land where they plan to build the data centers the utility will condemn dozens of private homes. The County Commission voted to allow the deal. The power company could route the power around the community, but it would increase the cost of the lines - costs that would be passed along to the hyperscaler - and at some price it is cheaper for the hyperscaler to generate their own power. As for noise - data centers produce about as much noise as an office building - by far the quietest industrial user of energy. That being said, I wouldn't allow an office building to be built in my neighborhood or next to my farm - this is why zoning is important. Put data centers in the middle of nowhere or around other industrial/office users.
AI data centers are not "average" and I highly doubt, but have no actual data (and no data was provided in your linked article to support that assertion), that the average data center uses the same amount of energy of 7 - 13 homes. Just the HVAC alone before considering all the servers and other equipment would push the energy use higher. HVAC systems in data centers run 24x7x365, not so in homes and the appliances in homes do not generate anywhere near the amount of heat generated by servers and other electronics in a data center.
You still miss the point that we have large manufacturing facilities that use huge amounts of electricity and no one complains. The fact is that 32% of energy consumption is manufacturing, and data centers consume only around 4.4% of the entire amount of electricity consumed. By 2030 it is projected that data centers may use up to 12% of electricity generated. Reality is that by using small nuclear reactors for large data centers, there would be cogeneration and the return of excess energy back into the grid. Electric companies would benefit from private data centers producing energy and lowering rates to individual consumers. Here is a congressional report on energy use and data centers: https://www.congress.gov/crs_external_products/R/PDF/R48646/R48646.2.pdf
I did not miss that point at all - just pointed out data centers consume a lot of electricity - and I don't really have a problem with that until it becomes fictionally rationalized when comparing to residential usage. The pdf you linked was interesting but did not tell me much that I did not already know. I agree that SMRs can be the answer but they are not currently commercially available and until they are, the only viable solution is gas, coal and existing nuclear power. What is currently destroying our grid is the replacement of reliable gas, nuclear and coal power plants with unreliable and expensive wind and solar - neither of which can provide baseload or dispatchable energy since the sun does not always shine and the wind does not always blow and you can't command them to do so when demand spikes. And for those thinking batteries solve the back-up issue, think again. https://wattsupwiththat.com/2025/08/20/the-battery-storage-delusion-what-35-million-tons-of-industrial-effort-buys-you/?fbclid=IwY2xjawRpnn9leHRuA2FlbQIxMQBzcnRjBmFwcF9pZBAyMjIwMzkxNzg4MjAwODkyAAEeHMU38LwTM8mQRlrJLdDqV90CRWD7akOxhsxc2cY66QDDhIQgQEKHkfxUWpw_aem_bCX9MXNBoCOqLA0tLTRrpQ
We are the Saudis of LNG. The blocking of energy by environmental activists is behind all the lies that there is a shortage of cheap readily available energy resources. They are the same people who are anti-data centers. It comes from a mental aberration much like that of Luddites. If Americans want a prosperous society, we need to embrace the attitude that Cyrus McCormick had. The McCormick Reaper mechanized farming at a time when people didn’t believe it was possible.
BM, your point that data centers make a lot of noise is interesting. I think you would admit that airports make a lot of noise and the noise goes far beyond the instillation. I cannot imagine that data centers make as much noise as an airport. I have not heard of imminent domain used to provide land for a data center. Utility companies use imminent domain, but where has imminent domain been used for the purpose of establishing a data center? With small nuclear reactors to power the data centers, there would be no need for imminent domain to put power to them.
I don't disagree but the difference generally is that airports have been around for a long time and housing tended to grow up around them as opposed to having residential areas surrounded by open land that will suddenly be used for a large data center. I have not personally experienced what it would be like living next to a data center, but there are people who are now living in close proximity who have raised the issue.. As for imminent domain, I did not say it was the data center and if you watched the video, you would know that it was the power company, but the new power lines are to support a new data center. I am all for SMRs, but they are still in the future.
EB, may I suggest the people who made buggy whips, saddles, washboards, and clothespins had a lot to loose when cars and wringer washers were built. I know of no national programs to help those people “adjust” to modern the adoption of new technologies.
We’ve historically made those displaced by new tech figure things out for themselves, turn their skills into niche specialties, or be marginalized
That (mostly) worked when new technology took decades to take root and become dominant
Steam power, Internal combustion engines and electricity each took more than a generation to spread fully into the mainstream, and we were creating new jobs in related specialties at the same pace or better than the old jobs died off (well, until that whole Great Depression thing happened, at any rate)
Telecommunications took a bit longer than that, if you look at it as the span from telegraphs to switched phone service (I’m actually old enough to to remember Party Lines and live operators, and I lived in a place where local phone numbers were only 5 digits even in the 1980s)
PCs and the internet took nearly as long. Early PCs to mainstream business use of the internet was (depending on how exactly you measure that last bit) about 25 years.
This time?
We don’t have quite the same luxury
AI was niche five years ago, and will be structurally transformative within the next five.
How we deal with that from a societal/cultural/economic perspective will have a real impact, for better or worse
Accumulation of facts and knowledge i.e. a library of information, is the point of data centers. Those communities without libraries suffered when books and reading came about. Are you capable of having information at your fingertips without access to a library of resources? Data centers are modern libraries with trillions of data points and informational resources.
What exactly are the data centers for? The generic answer seems to be - China is doing it, so we have to do it too.
And it seems that suddenly we need hundreds, maybe thousands, of these data centers ASAP.
Would data centers be helpful in setting up a control grid like China has? Keeping track of everyone's cell phone location, communications, financial transactions, vaccine records, etc, creates a lot of data. Would data centers help to process vast amounts of data and create social credit scores?
Given what the government did during the Covid operation, the response to the above questions should not be "They would never do that!" They already do it in China.
The data centers are building frontier Ai models. These are going to control everything in our lives eventually. It is inevitable. So we have a choice - we can foster a domestic Ai industry and have some level of control over the 'alignment' of the models or we can let China win and control the industry and the model's alignment. We have enough problems with OpenAi and Antropic's woke Ai alignment models - censuring conservatives etc. Imagine if the Chinese Communist Party got to decide the right 'history' the right 'truth' etc - our children will grow up in a world defined by the CCP. If we allow our own domestic Ai industry to compete with China we have a chance of regulating its alignment.
What “level of control” do you think the people are going to have?
Is that the same “level of control” they have had over the current surveillance platforms that use them as the raw material that the TechLords have used to make themselves hundreds of billions?!
D7, you missed the big point that the CCP has a Command Economy, where America’s Economy is driven by the private sector and individuals investing. There is no such thing as equity even in Communist China. Do you really believe Xi is a friend to the US when the CCP is threatening to take over Taiwan which is the source of 90% of computer chips for the world?
I would say that the U.S. successfully tested a command economy during the Covid operation. I suspect that many in our government would be more than willing to implement it again if they could find a way to do so.
Radical democrats love the idea of power through a command economy while they tell us it is for the sake of equity. Mamdani is a proud Socialist Democrat. There is a long history of the Socialist Democratic Party in the US. Nothing new there.
The ship has already sailed on much of your concerns. Google, Facebook, telecom companies, and others including the government already have much of the data you are concerned about and China has created their "Big Brother" environment independent of AI. That does not mean that AI could not help in that endeavor, but it is not actually needed either.
No doubt that individual companies have data on us. Banks have financial transactions, social media have some personal information, etc.
But that's far removed from pulling it all together into a coordinated database that can be used to control people.
But if they could combine political affiliation, vaccine history, financial activity, personal contacts, etc., they would have a lot of power. Data centers could be very helpful in doing that. AI may or may not be needed.
Your use of “Luddite” as a pejorative is common, but the truth is more nuanced. Luddites were not opposed to technology itself. Many were artisans and craftsmen who were skilled in the use of weaving and other machinery. What they opposed was the aggregation of technology in massive factories that used low skilled, poorly paid workers to mass produce inferior products. The Luddite movement occurred at a time in Britain when elites had been attacking individual self sufficiency for more than a century (think “enclosure”). Yes, Luddites were violent, but so was the American Revolution. Luddism was propelled by a similar desire for individual freedom and self sufficiency. Although many arguments against AI data centers are clearly unreasonable, the distrust of large technology companies and the bureaucrats who enable them, that distrust is most certainly well placed.
Nobody forced people to be Luddites. It was a choice. Yes, it is now used as a pejorative, because it would have crippled society if everyone became Luddites. Much like barbarism, certain philosophies can stunt and harm societies. Moving ahead in the new SCOTUS decision, it is finally understood that making decisions based on skin color is wrong because racism is always wrong when it comes to the health of our society.
So you have covered the power grid and the water consumption, now do the hum that the neighboring communities are dealing with, why they put them in communities instead of outlying land and why they are forcing people out of their homes through eminent domain to do so.
I’m not against technology itself, I’m against what they do to people to push it
No one should deal with the noise or lose a generational home because of growth.
This , in my opinion is where the anger issues come in and rightfully so.
Politicians that take land from citizens to give to other citizens should be run out of town. I can't imagine using eminent domain to take my farm to give it to Google - hell no. Honestly, I have heard anecdotal stories about this in the anti-data center chatter - but I haven't seen any concrete examples of it. As for noise - local zoning handles this already. Data centers don't produce any more noise than office buildings - if a local community doesn't want commercial uses of property they shouldn't issue permits. But at the end of the day, data centers are very quiet - much quieter than almost any other industrial land use.
The costs to build new power plants is huge and investor owned utilities are attempting to push that cost onto current customers. Living in Arizona, that has been the intent of APS asking for double digit increases in rates in back to back years. Sorry, data centers cost all of us.
Videos of homeowners living near "data centers" whose water tables have been depleted have a valid point. Why, precisely, are all these "data centers" necessary? To what end? They use power and water.
What about the assertions that these massive data centers are only required because of the enormous “weight” of outdated operating IT systems that require all this computing power? Supposedly, transitioning to more contemporary systems would require only laptop-sized “data centers”. But the Tech Bros are married to the old proprietary systems, I’m told.
And since, once constructed, data centers require a relatively small work force, it seems they could be sited away from both neighborhoods and prime farm land.
Finally, if the utilities had not caved to the woke green deal and refused to pour countless billions down the “renewable” rat hole, they’d be in a much better position to be providing the required power now, from fossil fueled plants. If the DCs can put the final nail in the coffin of unreliable green power, we will have at least that to be thankful for.
Nice piece of work with historical perspective.... thank you..
5381 Data centers already exist inside United States.. ChatGpt says if there are no others built.. It will require a minimum of eight years to possibly as much as 15 to create the necessary infrastructure A to Z for their full use.. So yes, China has a large advantage in creating infrastructure.. a tiny portion of red tape regarding build out compared to the US.
The good news is America's AI is currently more advanced than China's.
How to maintain this advantage.. firstly US data centers have got to get off the water [America's underground aquifer systems are already in a badly depleted state.. most of the American West has very very little recharge].. DC's and especially hyper scale DC's installations are having a negative impact on the local communities.. both financially and environmentally.. Too much puffing about AI benefits.. Reality is substantially different..
We have to see more innovations in cooling system Technology.. Simultaneously designing Chips that don't require so much cooling..
Real world we're not gonna be able to build infrastructure as quickly as China.. nope..
Consequently...We must maintain our AI tech Advantage..
Silicon Valley could probably benefit by remembering.. Henry Ford's response to his engineers `when they said his request for a V8 engine is not possible... it's never been done..' Ford said, build it or I'll find a group of engineers who can...
"It is 1942. The federal government has begun the Manhattan Project. "
Your analogy fails because of one omitted fact. "The United States is in a declared state of War with the A." That makes the legal, economic, and political situation entirely different. Maybe a declaration of war on Communist China is needed.
AI is the genie let out of the bottle. There’s no stuffing it back in. It comes promising all sorts of revolutionary changes to how we live, but we don’t get a vote on whether we like those things or think they are as good as we’re being promised.
It also comes fraught with a plethora of extremely dangerous aspects that can dramatically alter life on this planet as we know it , and not for the better.
Are we to trust the people tinkering with all this new technology to do what’s good, right and true, when we’ve already been exposed to what they’ve been willing to do with the internet and social media to control and manipulate us?
I’m obviously not one of the cheerleaders for this technology. I think it is a runaway train, and I do not trust most humans to do the right thing, especially when enormous profit and outsized power are involved.
I just pray God has mercy on us as we travel further and further down this path.
If the CCP becomes America’s source of Ai, we will not be able to counter their incursions into our American way of life. The CCP is Anti-Freedom. It is part of their name—Chinese Communist Party.
As a resident of the Permian Basin I understand the questions regarding water usage of the centers. We experience perpetual droughts and live above diminishing aquifers. I’m not against data centers and know people who own the land under some that are being built but the water question is real. Whether it’s 5 million gallons (or what ever the real number is) or 500,000 gallons a day for golf courses we have few water sources and I think rightfully do question the water use. Wells in this area only produce brackish undrinkable water and it costs about $20k to drill if you want to use it for lawns. The Permian Basin is a place of entrepreneurial spirit and hard working people, the actual and true data just needs to be communicated to those of us that live there.
I *broadly* agree with you, with two moderate caveats
1. The power grid needs, in many cases, to be upgraded and stabilized to support the needs of both the data centers and their surrounding communities, which is not trivial
2. Water supplies likewise need substantial work in many locations
The data center owners have, thus far, not been “wildly successful” in either case, and are proving to be less-than-ideal neighbors
That’s the physical infrastructure side of the coin
On the point of “existential angst”, for those whose livelihoods are or will be affected by AI, we need to pay close attention to the lessons learned from previous technology revolutions
Clear, timely, useful, accurate information has to be made available, and there needs to be some kind of plan to help people shift and adapt
The last revolution - PCs and the internet - took about 15 years to have its full impact felt across the board. This one will be much faster
“Everything will be just fine, trust me bro” isn’t the most trustworthy or reassuring message, even if it’s true
Thoughts...
1. If we didn't build another data center and only look to the EV market the grid is woefully underbuilt. The states pushing hardest for EV adoption haven't bothered to invest in transmission and generation. The good news is that the hyperscalers want to build their own generation behind the meter. The biggest obstacle to this are the regulated utilities who don't want to be cut out of the equation.
2. Water is an issue everywhere - but data centers aren't the cause - growth is. My first startup in the late 90s built and ran data centers (LayerOne) and we never used water for cooling. The fact is that using water to cool a data center only makes sense if the water is abundant and cheaper than the corresponding electricity that air cooling would require. That means that water isn't an issue in 99% of cases. On top of that new technology has made water cooled solutions far more efficient than they were in the 90s.
3. We had data centers in Dallas, St. Louis, Chicago, New York City, Miami and Los Angeles. I don't think most people knew what was inside our buildings. No one ever complained.
4. As for surrendering the Ai race to China, I believe that could be an existential threat to our national security for a million reasons. At the end of the day, China is moving forward at full speed and I don't want them to control the alignment of our models - I'm worried enough about OpenAi and Antropic's woke Ai alignment.
5. As for 'trust me bro' - I recommend against that. We need federal preemption on Ai regulation and we need best practices for data center permitting - teach the states how to get the best deal for their citizens.
Thanks for the response. I generally agree, especially re: the surrendering to China. I am not against AI data centers, I just think we need to take appropriate steps to assure we effectively address the concerns given that the DCs are larger and do consume more resources than "traditional" data centers . I sold hosting services before retiring in 2010 and was familiar with data center construction and use at that time - not so much now. To me, the biggest issue with power is the push for weather dependent, intermittent, variable, unreliable, grid damaging and expensive wind and solar to replace reliable fossil fuel power plants - including coal. That is what is putting the greatest strain on the grid. When you consider the entire life cycle for wind and solar, it becomes clear that they are far more environmentally destructive than simply using hydrocarbons to begin with given that they are effectively 100% dependent on hydrocarbons from cradle to grave starting with the massive amount of mining and processing required to extract the minerals needed for their manufacture, then transport, manufacture, site prep, life cycle maintenance and ultimate decommissioning and disposal with the added benefit of a relatively short life span so they need to be "renewed" more frequently. That, and the land use issue.
Robert Bryce, who is actually a supporter of sorts for solar, put together the linked video. One money line in the video shows a comparison of a 270 MW (nameplate) solar complex in Texas covering 2300 acres or 3.5 square miles to a 1200 MW gas plant covering 26 acres or 88 times smaller while producing over 4 times as much electricity 24/7/365 while the solar complex produces electricity maybe 20% of the time and never after sundown or before sunrise. Also, that solar farm may last 15-20 years at best whereas the gas plant will last 50 years or longer. And, those solar panels can't be produced without burning a lot of fossil fuels to power the machinery needed to mine/process/transport minerals, manufacture, site prep, lifecycle maintenance and ultimate decommissioning – and what are we going to do with all those end of life solar panels? And who benefits most from all this? China! https://robertbryce.substack.com/p/sunblock-the-global-fight-to-save?utm_id=97758_v0_s00_e232_tv2_tp1_a1demoo4qyk3vl&fbclid=IwY2xjawRxakhleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicmlkETFIcUdKYTUyZE1EMzFicGFOc3J0YwZhcHBfaWQQMjIyMDM5MTc4ODIwMDg5MgABHici4HKcokwRfS-oKimRolRfx4snnEbtC2O5PpSEso5lCKegL0NLq2vftLLw_aem_ADFr_66sMGdRwWCSd6RMsw
We surrendered solar to China.
And at 30% output they think they got a deal?
They aren't using it; they're getting their enemies to use it while monopolising manufacture. See the difference?
I also think that concerns about specific locations (such as placing them too close to existing populations or using eminent domain because they “prefer” the site) need to be addressed. As someone put it, there’s no shortage of open spaces in this country. I understand that infrastructure is necessary but our infrastructure already needs a ton of work, so combine the two.
There's one factor in AI that I haven't yet seen addressed: the Panopticon Effect.
Right now, we literally have no anonymity from either private or government snooping. If the government wants to avoid the whole "probable cause" effect, they can just buy all kinds of data that they physically couldn't have gotten access to because your commercial transactions, where you went, who you met, etc. were all considered as part of your "private papers". That started eroding with the advent of the internet. Then it accelerated through cell phones and "smart devices", but there were still limitations because a human being had to think to ask, and then analyze the data with their own human brains.
Once data mining became a thing, it was obvious where this was headed. Now, with Agentic AI, we have a 24/7/365 army of snoops to crawl through the data looking for any hint of non-conformity. And there's effectively NO requirement even for suspicion. Just ask the clanker to spit out anyone's name at all, regardless of bias in the AI and it's training data. Heck, this blog comment is probably a red flag. And once a flag goes up, our three felonies a day legal system will provide Beria with a long list of crimes.
It would be a good thing if President Trump would put out a regulation requiring probable cause and a warrant before commercial data can be accessed for legal purposes, because it's part of the 4th Amendment "private papers".
Better would be for Congress to say that in a formal law, and / or SCOTUS to confirm.
Best would be to add an Amendment saying the 4th Amendment "private papers" includes electronic records from any source.
We haven’t had privacy in a long time. It is getting worse. China is using the vast data about their citizens to predict, based on what you movies you watch, books you read, what you buy, what channel your TV is on at what time - if you’re going to be a problem. Pre-crime is real in China.
However, the average citizen has had a 4 year tutorial in what that means. But of course saying you don't trust the government will still get you labeled paranoid. Answer: Use the paranoia that's acceptable: ecological ctastrophe.
Exactly.
Correct with one addition - land use and siting. While worries about "big brother" or job losses are concerning to some, I think they are a bit exaggerated. But the power issues, water usage and siting are the real issues in communities that are fighting them. AI data centers are larger, require a lot mor power and while closed loop water cooling systems can mitigate water usage issues, they don't eliminate them. Also, their cooling systems make a lot of noise so when sited near a residential area, they do have an impact. That, and like is shown in the linked article, when power companies take over homesites via imminent domain, they don't endear themselves to the locals. https://blackmon.substack.com/p/a-message-for-datacenter-developers?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=712558&post_id=197488474&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=kv2ig&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email
I just looked at this deal. Same thing is happening here in Texas. So basically, Georgia Power wants to sell more electricity. They convince a hyperscaler to build their 800 acre facility near their power plant instead of them building their own power generation behind the meter. To get the power to the land where they plan to build the data centers the utility will condemn dozens of private homes. The County Commission voted to allow the deal. The power company could route the power around the community, but it would increase the cost of the lines - costs that would be passed along to the hyperscaler - and at some price it is cheaper for the hyperscaler to generate their own power. As for noise - data centers produce about as much noise as an office building - by far the quietest industrial user of energy. That being said, I wouldn't allow an office building to be built in my neighborhood or next to my farm - this is why zoning is important. Put data centers in the middle of nowhere or around other industrial/office users.
The average data center annually uses the same amount of energy that 7 to 13 homes use, yet no one talks about how much electricity is used by a new strip mall or grocery store. 🤷♀️ https://www.agproud.com/articles/61952-lines-land-and-legal-notices-what-to-do-when-you-get-an-eminent-domain-notice
AI data centers are not "average" and I highly doubt, but have no actual data (and no data was provided in your linked article to support that assertion), that the average data center uses the same amount of energy of 7 - 13 homes. Just the HVAC alone before considering all the servers and other equipment would push the energy use higher. HVAC systems in data centers run 24x7x365, not so in homes and the appliances in homes do not generate anywhere near the amount of heat generated by servers and other electronics in a data center.
You still miss the point that we have large manufacturing facilities that use huge amounts of electricity and no one complains. The fact is that 32% of energy consumption is manufacturing, and data centers consume only around 4.4% of the entire amount of electricity consumed. By 2030 it is projected that data centers may use up to 12% of electricity generated. Reality is that by using small nuclear reactors for large data centers, there would be cogeneration and the return of excess energy back into the grid. Electric companies would benefit from private data centers producing energy and lowering rates to individual consumers. Here is a congressional report on energy use and data centers: https://www.congress.gov/crs_external_products/R/PDF/R48646/R48646.2.pdf
I did not miss that point at all - just pointed out data centers consume a lot of electricity - and I don't really have a problem with that until it becomes fictionally rationalized when comparing to residential usage. The pdf you linked was interesting but did not tell me much that I did not already know. I agree that SMRs can be the answer but they are not currently commercially available and until they are, the only viable solution is gas, coal and existing nuclear power. What is currently destroying our grid is the replacement of reliable gas, nuclear and coal power plants with unreliable and expensive wind and solar - neither of which can provide baseload or dispatchable energy since the sun does not always shine and the wind does not always blow and you can't command them to do so when demand spikes. And for those thinking batteries solve the back-up issue, think again. https://wattsupwiththat.com/2025/08/20/the-battery-storage-delusion-what-35-million-tons-of-industrial-effort-buys-you/?fbclid=IwY2xjawRpnn9leHRuA2FlbQIxMQBzcnRjBmFwcF9pZBAyMjIwMzkxNzg4MjAwODkyAAEeHMU38LwTM8mQRlrJLdDqV90CRWD7akOxhsxc2cY66QDDhIQgQEKHkfxUWpw_aem_bCX9MXNBoCOqLA0tLTRrpQ
We are the Saudis of LNG. The blocking of energy by environmental activists is behind all the lies that there is a shortage of cheap readily available energy resources. They are the same people who are anti-data centers. It comes from a mental aberration much like that of Luddites. If Americans want a prosperous society, we need to embrace the attitude that Cyrus McCormick had. The McCormick Reaper mechanized farming at a time when people didn’t believe it was possible.
BM, your point that data centers make a lot of noise is interesting. I think you would admit that airports make a lot of noise and the noise goes far beyond the instillation. I cannot imagine that data centers make as much noise as an airport. I have not heard of imminent domain used to provide land for a data center. Utility companies use imminent domain, but where has imminent domain been used for the purpose of establishing a data center? With small nuclear reactors to power the data centers, there would be no need for imminent domain to put power to them.
I don't disagree but the difference generally is that airports have been around for a long time and housing tended to grow up around them as opposed to having residential areas surrounded by open land that will suddenly be used for a large data center. I have not personally experienced what it would be like living next to a data center, but there are people who are now living in close proximity who have raised the issue.. As for imminent domain, I did not say it was the data center and if you watched the video, you would know that it was the power company, but the new power lines are to support a new data center. I am all for SMRs, but they are still in the future.
There's the BIG additional matter that AI is being used to replace half the entry level white collar jobs in the US as we speak.
Over the next few years the jobs being replaced will go up the experience ladder.
So why should we support these data centers that are being used for
1) military and spying applications (we're not stopping those, obviously)
2) AI needed to write term papers for students, and make stupid AI slop videos,
3) replace many of the white collar jobs in the US?
By the way, anyone that thinks there will be a universal basic income to replace that accounting job your kid will never get is dreaming.
🙏💯🙏😔😔😔
EB, may I suggest the people who made buggy whips, saddles, washboards, and clothespins had a lot to loose when cars and wringer washers were built. I know of no national programs to help those people “adjust” to modern the adoption of new technologies.
That’s exactly the issue here.
We’ve historically made those displaced by new tech figure things out for themselves, turn their skills into niche specialties, or be marginalized
That (mostly) worked when new technology took decades to take root and become dominant
Steam power, Internal combustion engines and electricity each took more than a generation to spread fully into the mainstream, and we were creating new jobs in related specialties at the same pace or better than the old jobs died off (well, until that whole Great Depression thing happened, at any rate)
Telecommunications took a bit longer than that, if you look at it as the span from telegraphs to switched phone service (I’m actually old enough to to remember Party Lines and live operators, and I lived in a place where local phone numbers were only 5 digits even in the 1980s)
PCs and the internet took nearly as long. Early PCs to mainstream business use of the internet was (depending on how exactly you measure that last bit) about 25 years.
This time?
We don’t have quite the same luxury
AI was niche five years ago, and will be structurally transformative within the next five.
How we deal with that from a societal/cultural/economic perspective will have a real impact, for better or worse
EB, everyone has the potential to be “marginalized” as you say when we learn something new or choose a better way. Even physician’s jobs are changing.
Yup
You’re absolutely correct
That’s why communication matters
Alongside education
There’s a middle ground between “everything will be fine, just trust us and adapt” and “the sky is falling and SkyNet is upon us”
That middle ground is what I’m talking about
Accumulation of facts and knowledge i.e. a library of information, is the point of data centers. Those communities without libraries suffered when books and reading came about. Are you capable of having information at your fingertips without access to a library of resources? Data centers are modern libraries with trillions of data points and informational resources.
You make an excellent case for AI datacenters. I'm of the opinion that they are the future and we need to embrace them now.
Exactly. Data centers benefit everyone.
The great Moonshots podcast had part of the answer here:
Rural areas will benefit greatly from the taxes generated by data centers.
Imagine if they could offset property taxes for a period of years - or forever?
What exactly are the data centers for? The generic answer seems to be - China is doing it, so we have to do it too.
And it seems that suddenly we need hundreds, maybe thousands, of these data centers ASAP.
Would data centers be helpful in setting up a control grid like China has? Keeping track of everyone's cell phone location, communications, financial transactions, vaccine records, etc, creates a lot of data. Would data centers help to process vast amounts of data and create social credit scores?
Given what the government did during the Covid operation, the response to the above questions should not be "They would never do that!" They already do it in China.
The data centers are building frontier Ai models. These are going to control everything in our lives eventually. It is inevitable. So we have a choice - we can foster a domestic Ai industry and have some level of control over the 'alignment' of the models or we can let China win and control the industry and the model's alignment. We have enough problems with OpenAi and Antropic's woke Ai alignment models - censuring conservatives etc. Imagine if the Chinese Communist Party got to decide the right 'history' the right 'truth' etc - our children will grow up in a world defined by the CCP. If we allow our own domestic Ai industry to compete with China we have a chance of regulating its alignment.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
What “level of control” do you think the people are going to have?
Is that the same “level of control” they have had over the current surveillance platforms that use them as the raw material that the TechLords have used to make themselves hundreds of billions?!
Not sure what you are saying.
Your comment about “control” of AI is delusional.
Not sure what you mean.
D7, you missed the big point that the CCP has a Command Economy, where America’s Economy is driven by the private sector and individuals investing. There is no such thing as equity even in Communist China. Do you really believe Xi is a friend to the US when the CCP is threatening to take over Taiwan which is the source of 90% of computer chips for the world?
I would say that the U.S. successfully tested a command economy during the Covid operation. I suspect that many in our government would be more than willing to implement it again if they could find a way to do so.
Radical democrats love the idea of power through a command economy while they tell us it is for the sake of equity. Mamdani is a proud Socialist Democrat. There is a long history of the Socialist Democratic Party in the US. Nothing new there.
The ship has already sailed on much of your concerns. Google, Facebook, telecom companies, and others including the government already have much of the data you are concerned about and China has created their "Big Brother" environment independent of AI. That does not mean that AI could not help in that endeavor, but it is not actually needed either.
No doubt that individual companies have data on us. Banks have financial transactions, social media have some personal information, etc.
But that's far removed from pulling it all together into a coordinated database that can be used to control people.
But if they could combine political affiliation, vaccine history, financial activity, personal contacts, etc., they would have a lot of power. Data centers could be very helpful in doing that. AI may or may not be needed.
Your use of “Luddite” as a pejorative is common, but the truth is more nuanced. Luddites were not opposed to technology itself. Many were artisans and craftsmen who were skilled in the use of weaving and other machinery. What they opposed was the aggregation of technology in massive factories that used low skilled, poorly paid workers to mass produce inferior products. The Luddite movement occurred at a time in Britain when elites had been attacking individual self sufficiency for more than a century (think “enclosure”). Yes, Luddites were violent, but so was the American Revolution. Luddism was propelled by a similar desire for individual freedom and self sufficiency. Although many arguments against AI data centers are clearly unreasonable, the distrust of large technology companies and the bureaucrats who enable them, that distrust is most certainly well placed.
Nobody forced people to be Luddites. It was a choice. Yes, it is now used as a pejorative, because it would have crippled society if everyone became Luddites. Much like barbarism, certain philosophies can stunt and harm societies. Moving ahead in the new SCOTUS decision, it is finally understood that making decisions based on skin color is wrong because racism is always wrong when it comes to the health of our society.
So you have covered the power grid and the water consumption, now do the hum that the neighboring communities are dealing with, why they put them in communities instead of outlying land and why they are forcing people out of their homes through eminent domain to do so.
I’m not against technology itself, I’m against what they do to people to push it
No one should deal with the noise or lose a generational home because of growth.
This , in my opinion is where the anger issues come in and rightfully so.
Politicians that take land from citizens to give to other citizens should be run out of town. I can't imagine using eminent domain to take my farm to give it to Google - hell no. Honestly, I have heard anecdotal stories about this in the anti-data center chatter - but I haven't seen any concrete examples of it. As for noise - local zoning handles this already. Data centers don't produce any more noise than office buildings - if a local community doesn't want commercial uses of property they shouldn't issue permits. But at the end of the day, data centers are very quiet - much quieter than almost any other industrial land use.
The costs to build new power plants is huge and investor owned utilities are attempting to push that cost onto current customers. Living in Arizona, that has been the intent of APS asking for double digit increases in rates in back to back years. Sorry, data centers cost all of us.
To know Utlity Finance and Accounting is to love bricks and mortar.
Videos of homeowners living near "data centers" whose water tables have been depleted have a valid point. Why, precisely, are all these "data centers" necessary? To what end? They use power and water.
What about the assertions that these massive data centers are only required because of the enormous “weight” of outdated operating IT systems that require all this computing power? Supposedly, transitioning to more contemporary systems would require only laptop-sized “data centers”. But the Tech Bros are married to the old proprietary systems, I’m told.
And since, once constructed, data centers require a relatively small work force, it seems they could be sited away from both neighborhoods and prime farm land.
Finally, if the utilities had not caved to the woke green deal and refused to pour countless billions down the “renewable” rat hole, they’d be in a much better position to be providing the required power now, from fossil fueled plants. If the DCs can put the final nail in the coffin of unreliable green power, we will have at least that to be thankful for.
Seems like the AI money is being distributed to conservative influencers. Funny how all of a sudden we see these pro-Data center articles.
Nice piece of work with historical perspective.... thank you..
5381 Data centers already exist inside United States.. ChatGpt says if there are no others built.. It will require a minimum of eight years to possibly as much as 15 to create the necessary infrastructure A to Z for their full use.. So yes, China has a large advantage in creating infrastructure.. a tiny portion of red tape regarding build out compared to the US.
The good news is America's AI is currently more advanced than China's.
How to maintain this advantage.. firstly US data centers have got to get off the water [America's underground aquifer systems are already in a badly depleted state.. most of the American West has very very little recharge].. DC's and especially hyper scale DC's installations are having a negative impact on the local communities.. both financially and environmentally.. Too much puffing about AI benefits.. Reality is substantially different..
We have to see more innovations in cooling system Technology.. Simultaneously designing Chips that don't require so much cooling..
Real world we're not gonna be able to build infrastructure as quickly as China.. nope..
Consequently...We must maintain our AI tech Advantage..
Silicon Valley could probably benefit by remembering.. Henry Ford's response to his engineers `when they said his request for a V8 engine is not possible... it's never been done..' Ford said, build it or I'll find a group of engineers who can...
What could go wrong?
https://fortune.com/2026/05/12/lake-tahoe-data-center-49000-residents-power-source/
"It is 1942. The federal government has begun the Manhattan Project. "
Your analogy fails because of one omitted fact. "The United States is in a declared state of War with the A." That makes the legal, economic, and political situation entirely different. Maybe a declaration of war on Communist China is needed.
We are at war with China albeit an undeclared war.
CND. Fracking. And now this. Plus ca change.
AI is the genie let out of the bottle. There’s no stuffing it back in. It comes promising all sorts of revolutionary changes to how we live, but we don’t get a vote on whether we like those things or think they are as good as we’re being promised.
It also comes fraught with a plethora of extremely dangerous aspects that can dramatically alter life on this planet as we know it , and not for the better.
Are we to trust the people tinkering with all this new technology to do what’s good, right and true, when we’ve already been exposed to what they’ve been willing to do with the internet and social media to control and manipulate us?
I’m obviously not one of the cheerleaders for this technology. I think it is a runaway train, and I do not trust most humans to do the right thing, especially when enormous profit and outsized power are involved.
I just pray God has mercy on us as we travel further and further down this path.
If the CCP becomes America’s source of Ai, we will not be able to counter their incursions into our American way of life. The CCP is Anti-Freedom. It is part of their name—Chinese Communist Party.
And Palantir is Pro-Freedom?
https://x.com/WallStreetApes/status/2054910853518856503?s=20
As a resident of the Permian Basin I understand the questions regarding water usage of the centers. We experience perpetual droughts and live above diminishing aquifers. I’m not against data centers and know people who own the land under some that are being built but the water question is real. Whether it’s 5 million gallons (or what ever the real number is) or 500,000 gallons a day for golf courses we have few water sources and I think rightfully do question the water use. Wells in this area only produce brackish undrinkable water and it costs about $20k to drill if you want to use it for lawns. The Permian Basin is a place of entrepreneurial spirit and hard working people, the actual and true data just needs to be communicated to those of us that live there.